Is not a vow of silence helpful?

Devotee:  Is not a vow of silence helpful?

Ramana Maharishi:  A vow is only a vow. It may help dhyana to some extent. But what is the good of keeping the mouth closed and letting the mind run riot.   If the mind be engaged in dhyana, where is the need for speech? Nothing is as good as dhyana. Should one take to action with a vow of silence, where is the good of the vow?

If dhyana is gained there is no need for anything else.

Devotee:  What rite or action is necessary for the development of dhyana?

Ramana Maharishi:  Dhyana is itself the action, the rite and the effort. It is the most intense and potent of all. No other effort is necessary.

Devotee:  Is not japa necessary?

Ramana Maharishi:  Is dhyana not vak (speech)? Why is japa necessary for it?  If dhyana is gained there is no need for anything else.

How to meditate?

Dhyana:  How to meditate?

Ramana Maharishi:  Concentrate on that one whom you like best. If a single thought prevails, all other thoughts are put off and finally eradicated. So long as diversity prevails there are bad thoughts. When the object of love prevails only good thoughts hold the field. Therefore hold on to one thought only. Dhyana is the chief practice.
Dhyana means fight. As soon as you begin meditation other thoughts will crowd together, gather force and try to sink the single thought to which you try to hold. The good thought must gradually gain strength by repeated practice. After it has grown strong the other thoughts will be put to flight.
This is the battle royal always taking place in meditation. One wants to rid oneself of misery. It requires peace of mind, which means absence of perturbation owing to all kinds of thoughts. Peace of mind is brought about by dhyana alone.  When dhyana is well established it cannot be given up. It will go on automatically even when you are engaged in work, play or enjoyment. It will persist in sleep too.  Dhyana must become so deep-rooted that it will be natural to one.

Go to the root of the thoughts and you reach the stillness of sleep

Devotee:  Relatively speaking, is not the sleep state nearer to Pure Consciousness than the waking state?

Ramana Maharishi:  Yes, in this sense: When passing from sleep to waking the ‘I’ thought must start; the mind comes into play; thoughts arise; and then the functions of the body come into  operation; all these together make us say that we are awake. The absence of all this evolution is the characteristic of sleep and therefore it is nearer to Pure Consciousness than the waking state. But one should not therefore desire to be always in sleep. In the first place it is impossible, for it will necessarily alternate with the other states. Secondly it cannot be the state of bliss in which the Jnani is, for his state is permanent and not alternating. Moreover, the sleep state is not recognised to be one of awareness by people, but the sage is always aware. Thus the sleep state differs from the state in which the sage is established. Still more, the sleep state is free from thoughts and their impression to the individual. It cannot be altered by one’s will because effort is impossible in that condition. Although nearer to Pure Consciousness, it is not fit for efforts to realise the Self. The incentive to realise can arise only in the waking state and efforts can also be made only when one is awake. We learn that the thoughts in the waking state form the obstacle to gaining the stillness of sleep. “Be still and know that I AM God”. So stillness is the aim of the seeker. Even a single effort to still at least a single thought even for a trice goes a long way to reach the state of quiescence. Effort is required and it is possible in the waking state only. There is the effort here: there is awareness also; the thoughts are stilled; so there is the peace of sleep gained. That is the state of the Jnani. It is neither sleep nor waking but intermediate between the two. There is the awareness of the waking state and the stillness of sleep. It is called jagrat-sushupti. Call it wakeful sleep or sleeping wakefulness or sleepless waking or wakeless sleep. It is not the same as sleep or waking separately. It is
atijagrat 1 (beyond wakefulness) or atisushupti 2 (beyond sleep). It is the state of perfect awareness and of perfect stillness combined. It lies between sleep and waking; it is also the interval between two successive thoughts. It is the source from which thoughts spring; we see that when we wake up from sleep. In other words thoughts have their origin in the stillness of sleep. The thoughts make all the difference between the stillness of sleep and the turmoil of waking. Go to the root of the thoughts and you reach the stillness of sleep.  But you reach it in the full vigour of search, that is, with perfect awareness. That is again jagrat-sushupti spoken of before. It is not dullness; but it is Bliss. It is not transitory but it is eternal. From that the thoughts proceed. What are all our experiences but thoughts? Pleasure and pain are mere thoughts. They are within ourselves. If you are free from thoughts and yet aware, you are That Perfect Being.
 Relatively speaking, is not the sleep state nearer to Pure Consciousness than the waking state?
M.: Yes, in this sense: When passing from sleep to waking the ‘I’ thought must start; the mind comes into play; thoughts arise; and then the functions of the body come into  operation; all these together make us say that we are awake. The absence of all this evolution is the characteristic of sleep and therefore it is nearer to Pure Consciousness than the waking state. But one should not therefore desire to be always in sleep. In the first place it is impossible, for it will necessarily alternate with the other states. Secondly it cannot be the state of bliss in which the Jnani is, for his state is permanent and not alternating. Moreover, the sleep state is not recognised to be one of awareness by people, but the sage is always aware. Thus the sleep state differs from the state in which the sage is established. Still more, the sleep state is free from thoughts and their impression to the individual. It cannot be altered by one’s will because effort is impossible in that condition. Although nearer to Pure Consciousness, it is not fit for efforts to realise the Self. The incentive to realise can arise only in the waking state and efforts can also be made only when one is awake. We learn that the thoughts in the waking state form the obstacle to gaining the stillness of sleep. “Be still and know that I AM God”. So stillness is the aim of the seeker. Even a single effort to still at least a single thought even for a trice goes a long way to reach the state of quiescence. Effort is required and it is possible in the waking state only. There is the effort here: there is awareness also; the thoughts are stilled; so there is the peace of sleep gained. That is the state of the Jnani. It is neither sleep nor waking but intermediate between the two. There is the awareness of the waking state and the stillness of sleep. It is called jagrat-sushupti. Call it wakeful sleep or sleeping wakefulness or sleepless waking or wakeless sleep. It is not the same as sleep or waking separately. It is atijagrat 1 (beyond wakefulness) or atisushupti 2 (beyond sleep). It is the state of perfect awareness and of perfect stillness combined. It lies between sleep and waking; it is also the interval between two successive thoughts. It is the source from which thoughts spring; we see that when we wake up from sleep. In other words thoughts have their origin in the stillness of sleep. The thoughts make all the difference between the stillness of sleep and the turmoil of waking. Go to the root of the thoughts and you reach the stillness of sleep.  But you reach it in the full vigour of search, that is, with perfect awareness. That is again jagrat-sushupti spoken of before. It is not dullness; but it is Bliss. It is not transitory but it is eternal. From that the thoughts proceed. What are all our experiences but thoughts? Pleasure and pain are mere thoughts. They are within ourselves. If you are free from thoughts and yet aware, you are That Perfect Being.

The ego of the Jnani has been lost and he does not limit himself to this body or that, this event or that, and so on

Ramana Maharishi:  There is no difference between a Jnani and an ajnani in their conduct. The difference lies only in their angles of vision. The ignorant man identifies himself with the ego and mistakes its activities for those of the Self, whereas the ego of the Jnani has been lost and he does not limit himself to this body or that, this event or that, and so on. There is action in seeming inaction, and also inaction in seeming action as in the following instances:
1. A child is fed while asleep. On waking up the next morning, he denies having been fed. It is a case of inaction in seeming action. For although the mother saw him take his food the child himself is not aware.
2. The cartman sleeps in the cart when it jogs along the way in the night and yet he reaches the destination and claims to have driven the cart. This is a case of action in  seeming inaction.
3. A man appearing to listen to a story nods his head to the speaker but yet his mind is otherwise active and he does not really follow the story.
4. Two friends sleep side by side. One of them dreams that both of them travel round the globe and have varied experiences. On waking the dreamer tells the other that both of them have been round the earth.

The Jnani is fully aware that the true state of Being remains fixed and stationary and that all actions go on around him.

Ramana Maharishi:  There is a fixed state; sleep, dream and waking states are mere movements in it. They are like pictures moving on the screen in a cinema show.  Everyone sees the screen as well as the pictures but ignores the screen and takes in the pictures alone. The Jnani however considers only the screen and not the pictures. The pictures certainly move on the screen yet do not affect it. The screen itself does not move but remains stationary. Similarly, a person travels in a train and thinks that he moves.

Really speaking he sits and reposes in his seat, and it is the train  which is steaming fast. He however superimposes the motion of the train on himself because he has identified himself with the body. He says, “I have passed one station - now another - yet another - and so on”. A little consideration will show that he sits unmoved and the stations run past him. But that does not prevent him from saying that he has travelled all the way as if he exerted himself to move every foot of the way. The Jnani is fully aware that the true state of Being remains fixed and stationary and that all actions go on around him. His nature does not change and his state is not affected in the least. He looks on everything with unconcern and remains blissful himself. His is the true state and also the primal and natural state of being. When once the man reaches it he gets fixed there. Fixed once, fixed ever he will be. Therefore that state which prevailed in the days of Pathala Linga Cellar continues uninterrupted, with only this difference that the body remained there immobile but is now active.

It is enough that a person becomes antarmukhi (inward-bent)

Ramana Maharishi:  The kramamukti school objects to the idea of sadyomukti (immediate liberation) because the Jnani is supposed to lose body-consciousness at the same time that ignorance is dispelled but he continues to live in the body. They ask, “How does the body function without the mind?” The answer is somewhat elaborate:Knowledge (jnana) is not  incompatible with ignorance (ajnana) because the Self in purity is found to remain along with ignorance-seed (ajnana beeja)  in sleep. But the incompatibility arises only in the waking and dream states. Ajnana has two aspects: avarana (veiling) and vikshepa (multiplicity). Of these, avarana (veiling) denotes the veil hiding the Truth. That prevails in sleep. Multiplicity (vikshepa) is activity in different times. This gives rise to diversity and prevails in waking and dream states (jagrat and svapna). If the veil, i.e., avarana is lifted, the Truth is perceived. It is lifted for a Jnani and so his karana sarira (causal body) ceases to exist. Vikshepa alone continues for him. Even so, it is not the same for a Jnani as it is for an ajnani.
The ajnani has all kinds of vasanas, i.e., kartrtva (doership) and bhoktrtva (enjoyership), whereas the Jnani has ceased to be doer (karta). Thus only one kind of vasana obtains for him. That too is very weak and does not overpower him, because he is always aware of the Sat-Chit-Ananda nature of the Self. The tenuous bhoktrtva vasana is the only remnant of the mind left in the Jnani and he therefore appears to be living in the body. This explanation when applied to the mantra amounts to this: A Jnani has his karana sarira destroyed; the sthula sarira (gross body) has no effect on him and is for all practical purposes destroyed too. The sukshma sarira (subtle body) alone remains. It is otherwise called ativahika sarira. It is this which is held by all persons after the physical body is given up. And with this they traverse to other lokas until another suitable physical body is taken. The Jnani is supposed to move in Brahmaloka with this sukshma sarira. Then that is also dissolved and he passes to final Liberation. The whole explanation is meant only for the onlooker. The Jnani himself will never raise such questions. He knows by his experience that he is not bound by any kind of limitations.
…..
These are all only words. It is enough that a person becomes antarmukhi (inward-bent). The sastras are not needed for an inward turned mind. They are meant for the rest.

“I-am-the-body” idea will become extinct only on Self-Realisation.

Ramana Maharishi:  What is natural to the state of Self-Realisation forms the disciplinary course in the other state. “I-am-the-body” idea will become extinct only on Self-Realisation. With its extinction the vasanas become extinct and all virtues will remain ever.

The jnani’s mind is like this moon before sunlight. It is there but not shining of itself.

Observing the moon before the rising sun, Sri Bhagavan remarked:  See the moon and also the cloud in the sky. There is no difference in their brilliance. The moon looks only like a speck of cloud. The jnani’s mind is like this moon before sunlight. It is there but not shining of itself.

There is no cogniser, nor cognition, nor the cognised. All merge into One Supreme Siva only!

Devotee:  “To remove my darkness and give me light, Thy Grace must work through ME only.”

Ramana Maharishi mentioned Manickavachagar’s:   “We do bhajana and the rest. But we have not seen nor heard of those who had seen Thee.” One cannot see God and yet retain individuality. The seer and the seen unite into one Being. There is no cogniser, nor cognition, nor the cognised. All merge into One Supreme Siva only!

Siva (Brahman) is the Being assuming these forms and the Consciousness seeing them

Ramana Maharishi:  There is no being who is not conscious and therefore who is not Siva. Not only is he Siva but also all else of which he is aware or not aware. Yet he thinks in sheer ignorance that he sees the universe in diverse forms. But if he sees his Self he is not aware of his separateness from the universe; in fact his individuality and the other entities vanish although they persist in all their forms. Siva is seen as the universe. But the seer does not see the background itself. Think of the man who sees only the cloth and not the cotton of which it is made; or of the man who sees the pictures moving on the screen in a cinema show and not the screen itself as the background; or again the man who sees the letters which he reads but not the paper on which they are written. The objects are thus Consciousness and forms. But the ordinary person sees the objects in the universe but not Siva in these forms. Siva is the Being assuming these forms and the Consciousness seeing them. That is to say, Siva is the background underlying both the subject and the object, and again Siva in Repose and Siva in Action, or Siva and Sakti, or the Lord and the Universe. Whatever it is said to be, it is only Consciousness whether in repose or in action. Who is there that is not conscious? So, who is not realised? How then can questions arise doubting realisation or desiring it? If ‘I’ am not pratyaksha to me, I can then say that Siva is not pratyaksha. These questions arise because you have limited the Self to the body, only then the ideas of within and without, of the subject and the object, arise. The objective visions have no intrinsic value. Even if they are everlasting they cannot satisfy the person. Uma has Siva always with Her. Both together form Ardhanariswara. Yet she wanted to know Siva in His true nature. She made tapas. In her dhyana she saw a bright light. She thought: “This cannot be Siva for it is within the compass of my vision. I am greater than this light.” So she resumed her tapas. Thoughts disappeared. Stillness prevailed. She then realised that BE-ing is Siva in His true nature.

How shall I effect it (Sink deep within and abide as the Self) as quickly as possible?

Devotee:  How shall I effect it (Sink deep within and abide as the Self) as quickly as possible?

Ramana Maharishi:  This is the obstacle for realisation. Can there be the individual without Siva? Even now He is you. There is no question of time. If there be a moment of non-realisation, the question of realisation can arise. But as it is you cannot be without Him. He is already realised, ever realised and never non-realised. Surrender to Him and abide by His will whether he appears or vanishes; await His pleasure. If you ask Him to do as you please, it is not surrender but command to Him. You cannot have Him obey you and yet think that you have surrendered. He knows what is best and when and how to do it. Leave everything entirely to Him. His is the burden: you have no longer any cares. All your cares are His. Such is surrender. This is bhakti. Or, enquire to whom these questions arise. Dive deep in the Heart and remain as the Self. One of these two ways is open to the aspirant.

Enquire “Who am I?” Sink deep within and abide as the Self.

Devotee:  I had a vision of Siva at about the time of my conversion to Hinduism. A similar experience recurred to me at Courtallam. These visions are momentary. But they are blissful. I want to know how they might be made permanent and continuous. Without Siva there is no life in what I see around me. I am so happy to think of Him. Please tell me how His vision may be everlasting to me.

Ramana Maharishi:  You speak of a vision of Siva. Vision is always of an object. That implies the existence of a subject. The value of the vision is the same as that of the seer. (That is to say, the nature of the vision is on the same plane as that of the seer.) Appearance implies disappearance also. Whatever appears must also disappear. A vision can never be eternal. But Siva is eternal The pratyaksha (vision) of Siva to the eye signifies the existence of the eyes to see; the buddhi (intellect) lying behind the sight; the seer behind the buddhi and the sight; and finally the Consciousness underlying the seer. This pratyaksha (vision) is not as real as one imagines it to be, because it is not intimate and inherent; it is not first-hand. It is the result of several successive phases of Consciousness. Of these, Consciousness alone does not vary. It is eternal. It is Siva. It is the Self.
The vision implies the seer. The seer cannot deny the existence of the Self. There is no moment when the Self as Consciousness does not exist; nor can the seer remain apart from Consciousness. This Consciousness is the eternal Being and the only Being. The seer cannot see himself. Does he deny his existence because he cannot see himself with the eyes as pratyaksha (in vision)? No! So, pratyaksha does not mean seeing, but BE-ing. “To BE” is to realise - Hence I AM THAT I AM. I AM is Siva. Nothing else can be without Him. Everything has its being in Siva and because of Siva. Therefore enquire “Who am I?” Sink deep within and abide as the Self. That is Siva as BE-ing. Do not expect to have visions of Him repeated. What is the difference between the objects you see and Siva? He is both the subject and the object. You cannot be without Siva. Siva is always realised here and now. If you think you have not realised Him it is wrong. This is the obstacle for realising Siva. Give up that thought also and realisation is there.

But abiding peace, i.e., santi, does not result (by concentration of mind). This is got only by the removal of avidya (ignorance).

Devotee:  There is a short account of the spiritual experiences of St. Theresa, in the March number of the Prabuddha Bharata. She was devoted to a figure of the Madonna which became animated to her sight, and she was in bliss. Is it the same as Saktipata?

Ramana Maharishi:  The animated figure indicates depth of meditation (dhyana bala). Saktipata prepares the mind for introversion. There is a process of concentration of mind on one’s own shadow which in due course becomes animated and answers questions put to it. That is due to strength of mind or depth of meditation. Whatever is external is also transitory. Such phenomena may produce joy for the time being. But abiding peace, i.e., santi, does not result. This is got only by the removal of avidya (ignorance).

This place or another is within you

Devotee:  This third visit to Tiruvannamalai seems to have intensified the sense of egoism in me and made meditation less easy. Is this an unimportant passing phase or a sign that I should avoid such places hereafter?

Ramana Maharishi:  It is imaginary. This place or another is within you. Such imaginations must end so that the places have nothing to do with the activities of the mind. Even your surroundings are not of your own accord; they are there as a matter of course. You must rise above them and not get yourself involved.

Hold the Self. Why think of children and reactions towards them?

Devotee:  The mind continues to feel partial towards children, possibly because of the form sometimes used to personify the Ideal. How can this preference be outgrown?

Ramana Maharishi:  Hold the Self. Why think of children and reactions towards them?

There is consciousness along with quietness in the mind; this is exactly the state to be aimed at.

Devotee:  There are times when persons and things take on a vague, almost transparent form, as in a dream. One ceases to observe them as from outside, but is passively conscious of their existence, while not actively conscious of any kind of selfhood. There is a deep quietness in the mind. Is it, at such times, ready to dive into the Self? Or is this condition unhealthy, the result of self-hypnotism? Should it be encouraged as a means of getting temporary peace?

Ramana Maharishi:  There is consciousness along with quietness in the mind; this is exactly the state to be aimed at. The fact that the question has been framed on this point, without realising that it is the Self, shows that the state is not steady but casual. The word ‘diving’ is appropriate to the state of outgoing tendencies when the mind is to be diverted and turned within so as to dive below the surface of externalities. But when deep quietness prevails without obstructing the consciousness, where is the need to dive? If the state be not realised as the Self, the effort to do so may be called ‘diving’. The state may in that way be said to be suitable for realisation or ‘diving’. Thus the last two questions in the paragraph are unnecessary.

Before I realised my Self I was wandering looking out for You; having now realised my Self I see that you are my Self

The audience in the hall were very attentively listening. One of them, a sincere devotee of Sri Bhagavan, was so impressed by it that he soon lost himself. He later described his experience as follows: “I was long wondering where the ‘current’ starts, within the body or elsewhere.  Suddenly, my body grew tenuous until it disappeared. The enquiry ‘Who am I?’ went on very clearly and forcibly. The sound of ‘I-I-I’ alone persisted. There was one vast expanse and nothing more. There was a hazy perception of the occurrences in the hall. I knew that people stood up to salute at the end of the Vedic chant. I wanted to stand: the thought soon deserted me. I was again lost in the one expanse. The experience continued until I heard the voice of Sri Bhagavan. That made me collect myself. Then I stood up and saluted. A strange feeling continued for more than half an hour. I cannot forget it. It is still haunting me.”

Sri Bhagavan listened to his words and was silent for some minutes.  A few observations fell from his lips: One may seem to go out of the body. But the body itself is not more than our thought. There can be no body in the absence of thought; no outgoing or incoming in absence of body. However, owing to habit, the feeling of going out arises.  A particle of hail falling on the surface of the sea melts away and becomes water, wave, froth, etc., in the sea. Similarly, the subtle intellect, rising up as the tiny dot (ego) from the heart and bulging out, finally enters into and becomes one with the Heart. Though milk remains as wide as the sea, can you drink it with a mouth as wide as the sea? You can suck it only through the tiny capillaries of the paps. Nammalvar, the Vaishnavite saint, has said: “Only my Self is you”. What does it mean? “Before I realised my Self I was wandering looking out for You; having now realised my Self I see that you are my Self”. How will this fit in with qualified monism? It must be explained thus: “Pervading my Self you remain as the antaryamin (Immanent Being). Thus I am a part of your body and you are the owner of the body (sariri)” Having given up one’s own body as not being oneself why should one become another’s (God’s) body? If one’s body is not the Self other bodies also are non-self. The protagonists of qualified monism think that individuality is necessary to experience the Bliss. Individuality, i.e., ‘I-ness’ should not be lost. Aha! The Self is not the body but your Self becomes the body of God! Is it not absurd?  Or if you make prapatti (surrender yourself) to God, you have made yourself over to Him and you are His and no longer yours. If He is in need of a body let Him look out for  Himself. You need not say He is the owner of a body.

How is the mind to be steadied?

Devotee:  How is the mind to be steadied?

Ramana Maharishi:  By strengthening it.

Devotee:   How to strengthen it?

Ramana Maharishi:  It grows strong by satsanga (the company of the wise).

God is phala data (dispenser of fruit).

Ramana Maharishi:   “Karma has its fruit (phala). They are like cause and effect. The interrelation of a cause and its effect is due to a Sakti whom we call God. God is phala data (dispenser of fruit).

Non-dual idea is advised, but not advaita in action.

Ramana Maharishi:  Non-dual idea is advised, but not advaita in action. How will one learn advaita, if one does not find a master and receive instructions? Is there not duality then? That is the meaning.

Is not the body itself a picture on the screen, the Self?

Devotee:  It is said in Aparoksha-anubhuti that hatha yoga is a necessary aid for inquiry into the Self.

Ramana Maharishi:  The hatha yogis claim to keep the body fit so that the enquiry may be effected without obstacles. They also say that life must be prolonged so that the enquiry may be carried to a successful end. Furthermore there are those who use some medicines (kayakalpa) with that end in view. Their favourite example is: the screen must be perfect before the painting is begun. Yes, but which is the screen and which the painting? According to them the body is the screen and the inquiry into the Self is the painting. But is not the body itself a picture on the screen, the Self?

Devotee:  But hatha yoga is so much spoken of as an aid.

Ramana Maharishi:  Yes. Even great pandits well versed in the Vedanta continue the practice of it. Otherwise their minds will not subside. So you may say it is useful for those who cannot otherwise still the mind.

Is not hatha yoga necessary for the inquiry into the Self?

Devotee:  Is not hatha yoga necessary for the inquiry into the Self?

Ramana Maharishi:  Each one finds some one method suitable to himself, because of latent tendencies (purva samskara).

Devotee:  Can hatha yoga be accomplished at my age?

Ramana Maharishi:   Why do you think of all that? Because you think it exterior to yourself you desire it and try for it. But do you not exist all along? Why do you leave yourself and go after something external?

It is a good sign that you have such feelings. But what can you do now?

Ramana Maharishi:   Soon after the announcement in the newspapers that Gandhiji was going to fast for twenty-one days in Yerwada jail, two young men came to Sri Bhagavan; they were very excited. They said “Mahatma is now fasting for twenty-one days. We want permission from Sri Bhagavan to run up to Yerwada so that we may also fast as long as he does. Please permit us. We are in a haste to go.” Saying so they made ready to rush out. Sri Bhagavan smiled and said, “It is a good sign that you have such feelings. But what can you do now?  Get the strength which Gandhiji has already got by his tapasya. You will afterwards succeed.”

Atma is always Sat-Chit-Ananda. Of these, the first two are experienced in all the states, whereas the last one is said to be experienced in sleep only.

Ramana Maharishi:  Vairagya is possible only for the wise. However, it is often misapplied  by the common folk. For instance, a man often says “I have determined not to go to cinema shows.” He calls it vairagya. Such wrong interpretation of the words and old sayings are not uncommon. Again, we often hear, “Dog seen, stone is not seen; stone seen, dog is not seen.” It is ordinarily understood to mean that one cannot find a brickbat to throw at a stray dog. But this popular saying has a much deeper significance. It is based on a story: A certain wealthy man’s house was closely guarded. It had also a ferocious dog chained to a pillar at the gate. The dog and the chain were however very skilful pieces of art. They were sculptured in stone but appeared life-like. A pedestrian on the road once took fright at the sight of the ferocious animal and hurt himself in his attempt to dodge it. A kindly neighbour took pity on him and showed him that it was not a living dog. When the man passed by it the next time he admired the skill of the sculptor and forgot his old  experience. Thus when he found it to be a dog, he could not see the stone of which it was made; and again when he found it a piece of sculpture he did not see any dog to hurt him. Hence the proverb. Compare it with ‘The elephant hides the wood and the wood hides the elephant.’ Here it is a wooden elephant. Atma is always Sat-Chit-Ananda. Of these, the first two are experienced in all the states, whereas the last one is said to be experienced in sleep only. The question arises how the true nature of the Self can be lost in the waking and dream states. It is, really speaking, not lost. In sleep there is no mind and the Self shines as Itself, whereas in the other two states what shines forth is the reflected light of the Self. Ananda is felt after the cessation of thoughts in sleep. It is also manifest on other occasions as love, joy, etc., priya, moda and pramoda. But they
are all chitta vrittis (modes of mind). When a man is walking in the street his mind is full of fleeting thoughts. Suppose he passes a bazaar where some fine mangoes are for sale. He likes the mangoes and purchases them. He is next anxious to taste them. So he hastens home and eats them and feels happy. When the fleeting thoughts give way to the pleasure at the sight of mangoes, it is priya, when he gets them as his own, the pleasure is moda; lastly, when he eats them, the pleasure is pramoda.
All the three kinds of pleasure are owing to the disappearance of other thoughts.

(Overcome difficulties) By means of devotion and company of the sages.

Devotee:  Difficulties are met with. How is one to get the strength necessary to overcome the obstacles which beset one’s path?

Ramana Maharishi:  By means of devotion and company of the sages.

Devotee:   Loss of individuality was just before mentioned as a prerequisite to moksha. Now devotion and association with the wise are advised as the methods. Is there not individuality implied in them e.g., in “I am a bhakta”, “I am a satsangi”?

Ramana Maharishi:  The method is pointed out to the seeker. The seeker has certainly not lost his individuality so far. Otherwise the question would not have arisen. The way is shown to effect the loss of individuality of the seeker. It is thus appropriate.

It will become natural after long practice.

Devotee:  Does the practice make one ill?

Ramana Maharishi:  Maybe. But all will be rightly adjusted of its own accord.

Devotee:  I practised dhyana for four hours a day and fixation of sight for two hours. I became ill. Then others said that it was owing to my practice. So I gave up dhyana.

Ramana Maharishi:  Matters will adjust themselves.
…..
Ramana Maharishi:  What is practice if it is not an attempt to make something natural? It will become natural after long practice.

iva is in fact knowledge only; yet owing to ignorance the wrong identity with the gross body results.

Ramana Maharishi:  Sat = Being = the substratum (adhara). From this proceeds the particular, namely the jiva who veiled by ignorance identifies himself with the gross body. Here ignorance stands for not investigating the Self. Jiva is in fact knowledge only; yet owing to ignorance the wrong identity with the gross body results.

Aham sphurana (the light of ‘I-I’) is unbroken, continuous.

Ramana Maharishi:  Aham vritti (‘I-thought’) is broken, Aham sphurana (the light of ‘I-I’) is unbroken, continuous. After the thoughts subside, the light shines forth.

How is the ego to be got rid of?

Devotee:  How is the ego to be got rid of?

Ramana Maharishi:  The ego must be held in order to get rid of it. Hold it first and the rest will be easy.

Devotee:  How is that to be held?

Ramana Maharishi:  Do you mean to say that there is one ego to hold another ego or to eliminate the other? Are there two egos?

Is the Hindu view of reincarnation correct?

Devotee:  Is the Hindu view of reincarnation correct?

Ramana Maharishi:  No definite answer is possible for this question. There are pros and cons for the view. Even the present birth is denied natvevaham jatu nasam etc., (Bhagavad Gita). We were never born, etc

What is the state of the realised man? Is he not acting?

Devotee:  What is the state of the realised man? Is he not acting?

Ramana Maharishi:  The question implies that the realised man is not the questioner. Why should you concern yourself with another? Your duty is to look to yourself and not ask of others.

Devotee:  The scriptures hold him up as the ideal.

Ramana Maharishi: Certainly. He is the ideal. You should realise the Self. Even if his state be now described, your understanding of it will be only according to your capacity. You admit that your capacity is limited. The scriptures say that the realised state admits of no limits. So then, the only way to understand his state is to realise the Self and experience the state. If the question arises afterwards the answer will be found.

Differences between Deep Sleep and Wakefulness, where The Self remains in both states

Ramana Maharishi:

Grace is not exterior.

Ramana Maharishi:  Grace is not exterior. In fact your very desire for grace is due to grace that is already in you.

What makes you seek a goal? It is a counter-question to be answered by you.

Devotee:  What is your quest? What is the goal? How far have you progressed?

Ramana Maharishi:  The goal is the same for all. But tell me why you should be in search of a goal? Why are you not content with the present condition?

Devotee:  Is there then no goal?

Ramana Maharishi:  Not so. What makes you seek a goal? It is a counter-question to be answered by you.

What is the mind? Why should you concentrate?

Devotee:  On what should I concentrate the mind after all the thoughts are expelled? I  do not see where I stand then and on what I should concentrate.

Ramana Maharishi:  For whom is the concentration?

Devotee:  For the mind.

Ramana Maharishi:  Then concentrate the mind.

Devotee:  On what?

Ramana Maharishi:  Answer the question yourself. What is the mind? Why should you concentrate?

We are in our Self. We are not in the world.

Devotee:  You have gained this state by great effort. What shall we poor souls do?

Ramana Maharishi:  We are in our Self. We are not in the world.

Imagine a dreamer saying, “May all these wake up before I do”. The dreamer is no more absurd than the amiable philosopher

Ramana Maharishi:  People often say that a mukta purusha should go out and preach his message to the people. They argue, how can anyone be a mukta so long as there is misery by his side? True. But who is a mukta? Does he see misery beside him? They want to determine the state of a mukta without themselves realising the state. From the standpoint of the mukta their contention amounts to this: a man dreams a dream in which he finds several persons. On waking up, he asks, “Have the dream individuals also wakened?” It is ridiculous. Again, a good man says, “It does not matter even if I do not get mukti. Or let me be the last man to get it so that I shall help all others to be muktas before I am one.” It is all very good.  Imagine a dreamer saying, “May all these wake up before I do”. The dreamer is no more absurd than the amiable philosopher aforesaid.

The former (the false 'I') cannot exist apart from the latter (the real 'I').

Devotee:  I meditate neti-neti (not this - not this).

Ramana Maharishi:  No - that is not meditation. Find the source. You must reach the source without fail. The false ‘I’ will disappear and the real ‘I’ will be realised. The former cannot exist apart from the latter.

When awareness is found in jagrat (waking) it must also be in sleep.

Devotee:  What is prajnana (Absolute Knowledge)?

Ramana Maharishi:  Prajnana (Absolute Knowledge) is that from which vijnana (relative knowledge) proceeds.

Devotee:  In the state of vijnana one becomes aware of the samvit (cosmic intelligence). But is that suddha samvit aware by itself without the aid of antahkaranas (inner organs)?

Ramana Maharishi:  It is so, even logically.

Devotee:  Becoming aware of samvit in jagrat by vijnana, prajnana is not found self-shining. If so, it must be found in sleep.

Ramana Maharishi:  The awareness is at present through antahkaranas. Prajnana is always shining even in sleep. If one is continuously aware in jagrat the awareness will continue in sleep also
Moreover, it is illustrated thus: A king comes into the hall, sits there and then leaves the place. He did not go into the kitchen. Can one in the kitchen for that reason say, “The king did not come here”? When awareness is found in jagrat it must also be in sleep.

Maya cannot obscure Sat, but it does obscure Chit and Ananda, making them appear as particulars

Ramana Maharishi:

Goodness is only relative. Good always implies bad also; they always co-exist. The one is the obverse of the other.

Devotee:  How could God Himself wake up the asura element and bring about constant warfare? Is not Pure Goodness the nature of God?

Ramana Maharishi:  Goodness is only relative. Good always implies bad also; they always co-exist. The one is the obverse of the other.

If that (mind) is turned within, it becomes still in course of time and that “I-AM” alone prevails. “I-AM” is the whole Truth.

Devotee:  I have been interesting myself in metaphysics for over twenty years. But I have not gained any novel experience as so many others claim to do. I have no powers of clairvoyance, clairaudience, etc. I feel myself locked up in this body and nothing more.

Ramana Maharishi:  It is right. Reality is only one and that is the self. All the rest are mere Phenomena in it, of it and by it. The seer, the objects and the sight, all are the self only. Can anyone see or hear, leaving the self aside? What difference does it make to see or hear anyone in close proximity or over enormous distance? The organs of sight and hearing are needed in both cases; so also the mind is required. None of them can be dispensed with in either case. There is dependence one way or another. Why then should there be a glamour about clairvoyance or clairaudience? Moreover, what is acquired will also be lost in due course. They can never be permanent. The only permanent thing is Reality; and that is the Self. You say “I am”, “I am going”, “I am speaking”, “I am working”, etc. Hyphenate “I am” in all of them. Thus I - AM. That is the abiding and fundamental Reality. This truth was taught by God to Moses: “I AM that I-AM”. “Be still and know that I-AM God.” so “I-AM” is God. You know that you are. You cannot deny your existence at any
moment of time. For you must be there in order to deny it. This (Pure Existence) is understood by stilling your mind. The mind is the outgoing faculty of the individual. If that is turned within, it becomes still in course of time and that “I-AM” alone prevails. “I-AM” is the whole Truth.

Self-Realisation is only a euphemism for elimination of ignorance.

Devotee:  Is there anything like pratyakshabhava in the state of realisation or is realisation merely felt or experienced as the very Being or Sthiti of the soul?

Ramana Maharishi:  Pratyaksha is very being and it is not feeling, etc.

Devotee:   Until the seeker realizes that he is the sought, the above questions arise for him (the former).

Ramana Maharishi:  True. See if you are the seeker. The Self is often mistaken for the knower. Is there not the Self in deep sleep, i.e., nescience? Therefore the Self is beyond knower and knowledge. These doubts are in the realm of mind. To speak from this point of view, the advice is to keep the mind clear, and when rajas and tamas are wiped off, then the satva mind alone exists. So the ‘I’ vanishes in the satva (oonadhal kan). Jnana chakshus does not mean that it is an organ of perception like the other sense-organs. Jnanameva chakshuh. Television,  etc., are not functions of jnana chakshus. So long as there is a subject and also an object it is only relative knowledge. Jnana lies beyond relative knowledge. It is absolute.
The Self is the source of subject and object. Now ignorance prevailing, the subject is taken to be the source. The subject is the knower and forms one of the triads whose  components cannot exist independent of one another. So the subject or the knower cannot be the ultimate Reality. Reality lies beyond subject and object. When realised there will be no room for doubt.
“Bhidyate hridayagranthih
chhidyante sarvasamsayah.”
The heart knot is snapped; doubts are set at rest. That is called pratyaksha and not what you are thinking of. Avidya nasa is alone Self-Realisation. Self-Realisation is only  owpacharika. Self-Realisation is only a euphemism for elimination of ignorance.

Effort is needed so long as there is mind.

D.: If no effort is needed, can the perpetuated state of emptiness of mind be called the state of realisation?

M.: Effort is needed so long as there is mind. The state of emptiness has been the bone of contention in all philosophies

There is indriya pratyaksha (directly perceived by senses), manasa pratyaksha (directly perceived by the mind) and sakshat pratyaksha (realised as the very Being). The last alone is true.

Devotee:  When all the thoughts are banished and the mind is still or enters into a state of nothingness or emptiness, what is the nature of effort needed on the part of the ‘seeker’ to have a pratyakshabhava of the ‘sought’ (e.g., seeing a mango as a mango)?

Ramana Maharishi:  Who sees nothingness or emptiness? What is pratyaksha? Do you call perception of mango pratyaksha? It involves the play of karma, karta, and karya (action, doer and deed). So it is relative and not absolute. Because you see a thing now you say there is nothing afterwards (i.e., when you no longer see it). Both are functions of the mind. What lies behind both these assertions is pratyaksha. There is indriya pratyaksha (directly perceived by senses), manasa pratyaksha (directly perceived by the mind) and sakshat pratyaksha (realised as the very Being). The last alone is true. The others are relative and untrue.

Be the Self; there will be no second thing to cause you fear.

Devotee:  I do not have fear in sleep whereas I have it now.

Ramana Maharishi:  Because dwiteeyadvai bhayam bhavati - fear is always of a second one. Of what are you afraid?

Devotee:  By reason of the perception of the body, the senses, the world, Isvara, doership, enjoyment etc.

Ramana Maharishi:  Why do you see them if they cause fear?

Devotee:  Because they are inescapable.

Ramana Maharishi:  But it is you who sees them. For whom is the fear? Is it for them?

Devotee:  No, it is for me.

Ramana Maharishi:  Because you see them, you fear them. Do not see them and there will be no fear.

Devotee:  What then should I do in the waking state?

Ramana Maharishi:  Be the Self; there will be no second thing to cause you fear.

Find out who does not realise and what he does not realise. Then it will be clear that there is no avidya (ignorance).

Devotee:  Having heard the truth, why does not one remain content?

Ramana Maharishi:   Because samskaras have not been destroyed. Unless the samskaras cease to exist, there will always be doubt and confusion (sandeha, viparita). All efforts are directed to destroying doubt and confusion. To do so their roots must be cut. Their roots are the samskaras. These are rendered ineffective by practice as prescribed by the Guru. The Guru leaves it to the seeker to do this much so that he might himself find out that there is no ignorance. This truth mentioned is in the stage of the hearing of the Truth (sravana). That is not drdha (firm). For making it unshaken, one has to practise reflection (manana) and one-pointedness (nididhyasana). These two processes scorch the seeds of vasanas so that they are rendered ineffective. Some extraordinary persons get drdha jnana (unshaken knowledge) even on hearing the Truth only once (sakrchhravana matrena). Because they are krthopasakah (advanced seekers), whereas the akrthopasakah (raw seekers) take longer to gain drdha jnana (unshaken knowledge). People ask: “How did ignorance (avidya) arise at all?” We have to say to them: “Ignorance never arose. It has no real being. That which is, is only vidya (knowledge).”

Devotee:  Why then do I not realise it?

Ramana Maharishi:  Because of the samskaras. However, find out who does not realise and what he does not realise. Then it will be clear that there is no avidya (ignorance).

To know that there never was ignorance is the goal of all the spiritual teachings.

A visitor had been speaking of the Self having forgotten its true nature.

Sri Bhagavan after some time said: “People speak of memory and oblivion of the Fullness of the Self. Oblivion and memory are only thought-forms. They will alternate so long as there are thoughts. But Reality lies beyond these. Memory or oblivion must be dependent on something. That something must be foreign too; otherwise there cannot be oblivion. It is called ‘I’ by everyone. When one looks for it, it is not found because it is not real. Hence ‘I’ is synonymous with illusion or ignorance (maya, avidya or ajnana). To know that there never was ignorance is the goal of all the spiritual teachings. Ignorance must be of one who is aware. Awareness is jnana. Jnana is eternal and natural. Ajnana is unnatural and unreal.

The tiny hole in the Heart is opened by vichara with the result that ‘I-I’ consciousness shines forth.

Devotee:  There arose a doubt if ‘I-I’ consciousness be the same as nirvikalpa samadhi or anything anterior to it.

Ramana Maharishi:  The tiny hole in the Heart remains always closed, but it is opened by vichara with the result that ‘I-I’ consciousness shines forth. It is the same as samadhi.

If you attain the state of wakeful sleep which is the same as samadhi, while still awake, doubts will not arise.

Devotee:  “I have an impression that in deep sleep I have something akin to samadhi. Is it so?”

Ramana Maharishi:   It is the waking ‘I’ that asks the questions - not the ‘I’ in sleep. If you attain the state of wakeful sleep which is the same as samadhi, while still awake, doubts will not arise.

If (mind is) divested of things the light alone will remain over.

Ramana Maharishi:  The mind functions both as light and as objects. If divested of things the light alone will remain over.

Effort is directed to extinguishing the 'I-thought' and not for ushering the true 'I'

Ramana Maharishi:

Is there no samadhi now?

Devotee:  Do not men go into samadhi?

Ramana Maharishi:  Is there no samadhi now?


Devotee:  Is it eternal?


Ramana Maharishi:  If not, how can it be real?


Devotee:  Then?


Ramana Maharishi:  There is no then, no now.


Devotee:  It appears so.


Ramana Maharishi: To whom?


Devotee:  To the mind.


Ramana Maharishi: What is mind? Who am I?


Devotee:  (Silence).

Change of outlook is all that is necessary

Devotee:  I think of Arunachala, but still I am not a mukta.


Ramana Maharishi:  Change of outlook is all that is necessary. See what such a change did for Arjuna. He had the vision, of the Cosmic Self. Sri Krishna says: “Gods and saints are eager to see my Cosmic Form. I have not fulfilled their desire. Yet I endow divine sight by which you can see that Form.” Well, having said so, does He show what He is? No. He asks Arjuna to see in Him all that he desires to see. If that were His real form it must be changeless and known for what it is worth. Instead, Arjuna is commanded to see whatever he desires. So where is the Cosmic Form? It must be in Arjuna. Furthermore, Arjuna finds Gods and saints in that form and they are praising the Lord. If the form be withheld from the Gods and saints as said by Krishna, who are they of Arjuna’s vision?


Devotee: They must be in his imagination.


Ramana Maharishi:  They are there because of Arjuna’s outlook.


Devotee: Then the outlook must be changed by God’s Grace.


Ramana Maharishi:  Yes. That happens to bhaktas.

Realise the Self or the Divine. All these differences will disappear.

A visitor asked Sri Bhagavan about the ‘over-mind’, and ‘super-mind’, the ‘Psychic’, the ‘Divine’ of Sri Aurobindo’s terminology.


Ramana Maharishi:  Realise the Self or the Divine. All these differences will disappear.

When practice remains unshaken it becomes sahaja (natural).

Ramana Maharishi:  Practice is power. If thoughts are reduced to a single thought the mind is said to have grown strong. When practice remains unshaken it becomes sahaja (natural).

Pratyabhijna is used for realising the ever-present Reality and recognising it.

Ramana Maharishi:  Pratyabhijna = Prati + abhijna. abhijna is direct perception; prati is to be reminded of what was already known. “This is an elephant” direct perception “This is that elephant” is pratyabhijna In technical works, pratyabhijna is used for realising the ever-present Reality and recognising it.

It (pure 'I') can be recognised only if it is consciously attained. Therefore make the effort and gain consciously.

In yesterday’s answers, Sri Bhagavan said that the Self is pure consciousness in deep slumber, and He also indicated the Self of the transition from sleep to the waking state as the ideal for realisation. He was requested to explain the same.

Sri Bhagavan graciously answered:  The Self is pure consciousness in sleep; it evolves as aham (‘I’) without the idam (‘this’) in the transition stage; and manifests as aham (‘I’) and idam (‘this’) in the waking state. The individual’s experience is by means of aham (‘I’) only. So he must aim at realisation in the way indicated (i.e., by means of the transitional ‘I’).  Otherwise the sleep-experience does not matter to him. If the transitional ‘I’ be realised the substratum is found and that leads to the goal. Again, sleep is said to be ajnana (ignorance). That is only in relation to the wrong jnana (knowledge) prevalent in the wakeful state. The waking state is really ajnana (ignorance) and the sleep state is prajnana (full knowledge). Prajnana is Brahman, says the sruti. Brahman is eternal. The sleep-experiencer is called prajna. He is prajnanam in all the three states. Its particular significance in the sleep state is that He is full of knowledge (prajnanaghana). What is ghana? There are jnana and vijnana. Both together operate in all perceptions. Vijnana in the jagrat is viparita jnana (wrong knowledge) i.e., ajnana (ignorance). It always co-exists with the individual. When this becomes vispashta jnana (clear knowledge), It is Brahman. When wrong knowledge is totally absent, as in sleep, He remains pure prajnana only. That is Prajnanaghana.Aitareya Upanishad says prajnana, vijnana, ajnana, samjnana are all names of Brahman. Being made up of knowledge alone how is He to be experienced? Experience is always with vijnana. Therefore the pure ‘I’ of the transitional stage must be held for the experience of the Prajnanaghana. The ‘I’ of the waking state is impure and is not useful for such experience. Hence the use of the transitional ‘I’ or the pure ‘I’. How is this pure ‘I’ to be realised? Viveka Chudamani says, Vijnana kose vilasatyajasram (He is always shining forth in the intellectual sheath, vijnana kosa). Tripura Rahasya and other works point out that the interval between two consecutive sankalpas (ideas or thoughts) represent the pure aham (‘I’). Therefore holding on to the pure ‘I’, one should have the Prajnanaghana for aim, and there is the vritti present in the attempt. All these have their proper and respective places and at the same time lead to realisation. Again the pure Self has been  described in Viveka Chudamani to be beyond asat, i.e., different from asat. Here asat is the contaminated waking ‘I’. Asadvilakshana means sat, i.e., the Self of sleep. He is also described as different from sat and asat. Both mean the same.  He is also asesha sakshi (all-seeing witness). If pure, how is He to be experienced by means of the impure ‘I’? A man says “I slept happily”. Happiness was his experience. If not, how could he speak of what he had not experienced? How did he experience happiness in sleep, if the Self was pure? Who is it that speaks of that experience now? The speaker is the vijnanatma (ignorant self) and he speaks of prajnanatma (pure self). How can that hold? Was this vijnanatma present in sleep? His present statement of the experience of happiness in sleep makes one infer his existence in sleep. How then did he remain? Surely not as in the waking state. He was there very subtle. Exceedingly subtle vijnanatma experiences the happy prajnanatma by means of maya mode. It is like the rays of the moon seen below the branches, twigs and leaves of a tree. The subtle vijnanatma seems apparently a stranger to the obvious vijnanatma of the present moment. Why should we infer his existence in sleep? Should we not deny the experience of happiness and be  done with this inference? No. The fact of the experience of happiness cannot be denied, for everyone courts sleep and prepares a nice bed for the enjoyment of sound sleep. This brings us to the conclusion that the cogniser, cognition and the cognised are present in all the three states, though there are differences in their subtleties. In the transitional state, the aham (‘I’) is suddha (pure), because idam (‘this’) is suppressed. Aham (‘I’) predominates. ‘Why is not that pure ‘I’ realised now or even remembered by us? Because of want of acquaintance (parichaya) with it. It can be recognised only if it is consciously attained. Therefore make the effort and gain consciously.

What does Bhagavan think of the “lost soul” mentioned by Jesus Christ?

Devotee:  What does Bhagavan think of the “lost soul” mentioned by Jesus Christ?

Ramana Maharishi:  Think what there is to be lost. Is there anything to lose? What matters is only that which is natural. Such must be eternal and cannot be experienced. That which is born must die; that which is acquired must be lost. Were you born? You are ever existent. The Self can never be lost.

The desire arose in the same way as the body arises to the Self.

Devotee:  “Sri Bhagavan! When I heard of you, a strong desire arose in me to see you. Why should it be so?”


Ramana Maharishi:  The desire arose in the same way as the body arises to the Self.

The Self is objectified as God. So also with Guru.

Devotee:  Saiva Siddhanta postulates three fundamentals as being eternal. Is it opposed to Vedanta?

Ramana Maharishi:  The three entities are jiva, God and bondage. Such trinities are common in all religions. They are true so long as the mind is operative. They are mere creations of the mind. One can postulate God only after the mind arises. God is not different from the Self.  The Self is objectified as God. So also with Guru.

What is inspired action?

Devotee:  What is inspired action?

Ramana Maharishi:  Let activities go on. They do not affect the pure Self.

They (Actions) are not your own. They are God’s activities.

Devotee:  Our work-a-day life is not compatible with such efforts.

Ramana Maharishi:  Why do you think that you are active? Take the gross example of your arrival here. You left home in a cart, took train, alighted at the Railway Station here, got into a cart there and found yourself in this Asramam. When asked, you say that you travelled here all the way from your town. Is it true? Is it not a fact that you remained as you were and there were movements of conveyances all along the way. Just as those movements are confounded with your own, so also the other activities. They are not your own. They are God’s activities.

Know that the mind promoting them (world / work) is not real but a phantom proceeding from the Self. That is how the mind is destroyed

Devotee:  Without the mind concentrating on it the work cannot be performed satisfactorily. How is the mind to be spiritually disposed and the work kept going as well?

Ramana Maharishi:  The mind is only a projection from the Self, appearing in the waking state. In deep sleep, you do not say whose son you are and so on. As soon as you wake up you say you are so and so, and recognise the world and so on. The world is only lokah, lokah =lokyate iti lokah (what is perceived is the world). That which is seen is lokah or the world. Which is the eye that sees it? That is the ego which rises and sinks periodically. But you exist always. Therefore That which lies beyond the ego is consciousness - the Self. In deep sleep mind is merged and not destroyed. That which merges reappears. It may happen in meditation also. But the mind which is destroyed cannot reappear. The yogi’s aim must be to destroy it and not to sink in laya. In the peace of dhyana, laya ensues but it is not enough. It must be supplemented by other practices for destroying the mind. Some people have gone into samadhi with a trifling thought and after a long time awakened in the trail of the same thought. In the meantime generations have passed away in the world. Such a yogi has not destroyed his mind. Its destruction is the non-recognition of it as being apart from the Self. Even now the mind is not. Recognise it. How can you do it if not in everyday activities. They go on automatically. Know that the mind promoting them is not real but a phantom proceeding from the Self. That is how the mind is destroyed

Loss of lives is wrong anyway. Are wars justified?

Devotee:  Loss of lives is wrong anyway. Are wars justified?


Ramana Maharishi:  For a realised man, the one who remains ever in the Self, the loss of one or several or all lives either in this world or in all the three worlds makes no difference. Even if he happens to destroy them all, no sin can touch such a pure soul. Maharshi quoted the Gita, Chapter 18, Verse 17 - “He who is free from the notion of ego, whose intellect is unattached, though he annihilates all the worlds, he slayeth not, nor is he bound by the results of his actions.”

What are asanas (postures or seats)? Are they necessary?

Devotee:  What are asanas (postures or seats)? Are they necessary?

Ramana Maharishi:  Many asanas with their effects are mentioned in the Yoga sastras. The seats are the tiger-skin, grass, etc.; the postures are the ‘lotus posture’, the ‘easy posture’ and so on.
Why all these - only to know oneself? “I am the body; the body requires a seat; it is the earth,” thinking thus, he seeks seats. But in sleep did he think of the support or the bed: the bed on the cot and the cot on the earth? Did he not exist in sleep too? How was he then? The truth is - Being the Self, the ego rising up, confusing himself with the body, mistaking the world to be real, differentiating the objects, covered by the ignorance of the ‘I’-conceit, he thinks wildly and also looks for seats. He does not understand that he himself is the Centre of all and thus forms the basis for all. If questioned he talks of the effects of seats and footwear in terms of gravitation, magnetism and so on. Without them he imagines that the power of his austerities will dwindle away. Where from do they all derive their power? He looks to the effects, seeks their causes and imagines them to be the power of seats and of footwear. A stone thrown up falls back to the ground. Why? Owing to the gravitation, says he. Well - are all these different from his thoughts?
Think and say if the stone, the earth and gravity are different from his thoughts. They are all in his mind only. He is the Power and the wielder of it. He is the Centre of all and their support. He is also the Seat. The seat is meant to make him sit firm. Where and how can he remain firm except in his own real state? This is the Seat.

Where were they all? Only in yourself

Ramana Maharishi:  As was already said, the purpose of the whole philosophy is to indicate the underlying Reality whether of the jagrat, svapna and sushupti states, or the individual souls, the world and God.
There are three outlooks possible:-
(1) The Vyavaharika: The man sees the world in all its variety, surmises the creator and believes in himself as the subject. All these are thus reduced to the three fundamentals, jagat, jiva and Isvara. He learns the existence of the creator and tries to reach him in order to gain immortality. If one is thus released from bondage, there are all other individuals existing as before who should work out their own salvation. He more or less admits the One Reality underlying all these phenomena. The phenomena are due to the play of maya. Maya is the sakti of Isvara or the activity of Reality. Thus, existence of different souls, objects, etc., do not clash with the advaitic point of view.
(2) The Pratibhasika: The jagat, jiva and Isvara are all cognised by the seer only. They do not have any existence independent of him. So there is only one jiva, be it the individual or God. All else is simply a myth.
(3) The Paramarthika: i.e., ajatavada (no-creation doctrine) which admits of no second. There is no reality or absence of it, no seeking or gaining, no bondage or liberation and  so on.
The question arises why then do all the sastras speak of the Lord as the creator? How can the creature that you are create the creator and argue that the jagat, jiva and Isvara are mental conceptions only? The answer is as follows:-
You know that your father of this jagrat state is dead and that several years have elapsed since his death. However you see him in your dream and recognise him to be your father, of whom you were born and who has left patrimony to you. Here the creator is in the creature. Again, you dream that you are serving a king and that you are a part in the administrative wheel of the kingdom. As soon as you wake up all of them have disappeared leaving you, the single individual, behind. Where were they all? Only in yourself. The same analogy holds good in the other case also.

As soon as one knows that it is a mirage, one gives it up as useless and does not run after it for procuring water.

Ramana Maharishi:  There are different methods of approach to prove the unreality of the universe. The example of the dream is one among them. Jagrat, svapna and sushupti are all treated elaborately in the scripture in order that the Reality underlying them might be revealed. It is not meant to accentuate differences among the three states. The purpose must be kept clearly in view. Now they say that the world is unreal. Of what degree of unreality is it? Is it like that of a son of a barren mother or a flower in the sky, mere words without any reference to facts? Whereas the world is a fact and not a mere word. The answer is that it is a superimposition on the one Reality, like the appearance of a snake on a coiled rope seen in dim light. But here too the wrong identity ceases as soon as the friend points out that it is a rope. Whereas in the matter of the world it persists even after it is known to be unreal. How is that? Again the appearance of water in a mirage persists even after the knowledge of the mirage is recognised. So it is with the world. Though knowing it to be unreal, it continues to manifest. But the water of the mirage is not sought to satisfy one’s thirst. As soon as one knows that it is a mirage, one gives it up as useless and does not run after it for procuring water.

Devotee:  Not so with the appearance of the world. Even after it is repeatedly declared to be false one cannot avoid satisfying one’s wants from the world. How can the world be false?

Ramana Maharishi:  It is like a man satisfying his dream wants by dream creations. There are objects, there are wants and there is satisfaction. The dream creation is as purposeful as the jagrat world and yet it is not considered real. Thus we see that each of these illustrations serves a distinct purpose in establishing the stages of unreality. The realised sage finally declares that in the regenerate state the jagrat world also is found to be as unreal as the dream world is found to be in the jagrat state. Each illustration should be understood in its proper context; it should not be studied as an isolated statement. It is a link in a chain. The purpose of all these is to direct the seeker’s mind towards the one Reality underlying them all.

Spirit is unlimited and formless. Such too is the spiritual centre. There is only one such centre.

Devotee:  The spiritual leaders in the West say that the spiritual centre is in India. Is there any contact among the spiritual leaders in India? Or is contact possible between the leaders of the East and the West?


Ramana Maharishi:  What do you mean by spiritual centre?


Devotee:  The spiritual centre is the seat of spiritual leaders.


Ramana Maharishi:  What do you understand by ‘spiritual leaders’?


Devotee:  In the West there is a crisis. Scientific knowledge is far advanced. Such knowledge is used for generating destructive forces. There is a movement for making them constructive. When thus diverted it will be for the good of the world. The leaders of this movement are the redeemers.


Ramana Maharishi:  By ‘spiritual leaders’ we understand those who are ‘spiritual’ as opposed to ‘physical’. Spirit is unlimited and formless. Such too is the spiritual centre. There is only one such centre. Whether in the West or in the East the centre cannot differ; nor has it any locality. Being unlimited it includes the leaders, the men, the world, the forces of destruction and of construction. There is no differentiation. You speak of contact because you are thinking of the embodied beings as spiritual leaders. The spiritual men are not bodies; they are not aware of their bodies. They are only spirit, limitless and formless. There is always unity among them and all others; nay, they comprise all.  The spirit is the Self. If the Self is realised, these questions cannot arise at all.

Watch the mind. You must stand aloof from it. You are not the mind

Devotee:  Is not the world reflected on the Self?


Ramana Maharishi:  For reflection there must be an object and an image. But the Self does not admit of these differences.


Devotee:  Does not then Bhagavan see the world?


Ramana Maharishi:  Whom do you mean by Bhagavan?


Devotee:  A jiva advanced more than I.


Ramana Maharishi:  If you understand your jiva the other jiva is also understood.


Devotee:  I do not want to discuss. I want to learn. Please instruct me.


Ramana Maharishi:  Because you desire to learn, discussion is unavoidable. Leave all this aside. Consider your sleep. Are you then aware of bondage or do you seek means for release? Are you then aware of the body itself? The sense of bondage is associated with the body. Otherwise there is no bondage, no material to bind with and no one to be bound. These appear, however, in your wakeful state. Consider to whom they appear.


Devotee:  To the mind.


Ramana Maharishi:  Watch the mind. You must stand aloof from it. You are not the mind. And the Self will remain ever.

The world is not another self similar to the self. It is not different from the self; nor is it part of the self.

Devotee:  Does Bhagavan see the world as part and parcel of Himself? How does He see the world?

Ramana Maharishi:  The Self alone is and nothing else. However, it is differentiated owing to ignorance. Differentiation is threefold: (1) of the same kind: (2) of a different kind, and (3) as parts in itself. The world is not another self similar to the self. It is not different from the self; nor is it part of the self.

What is avidya (Ignorance)?

Devotee:  Sri Bhagavan says that the Heart is the Self. Psychology has it that malice, envy, jealousy and all passions have their seat in the heart. How are these two statements to be reconciled?


Ramana Maharishi:  The whole cosmos is contained in one pinhole in the Heart. These passions are part of the cosmos. They are avidya (ignorance).


Devotee:  How did avidya arise?


Ramana Maharishi:  Avidya is like Maya [she who is not is maya (illusion)]. Similarly that which is not is ignorance. Therefore the question does not arise. Nevertheless, the question is asked. Then ask, “Whose is the avidya? Avidya is ignorance. It implies subject and object. Become the subject and there will be no object.


Devotee:  What is avidya?


Ramana Maharishi:  Ignorance of Self. Who is ignorant of the Self? The self must be ignorant of Self. Are there two selves?

You must admit your own existence. That existence is the Self. It is already realised.

Devotee:  I feel I am like froth.


Ramana Maharishi:  Cease that identification with the unreal and know your real identity. Then you will be firm and no doubts can arise.


Devotee:  But I am the froth.


Ramana Maharishi:  Because you think that way there is worry. It is a wrong imagination. Accept your true identity with the Real. Be the water and not the froth. That is done by diving in.


Devotee:  If I dive in, I shall find........


Ramana Maharishi:  But even without diving in, you are That. The ideas of exterior and interior exist only so long as you do not accept your real identity.


Devotee:  But I took the idea from you that you want me to dive in.


Ramana Maharishi:  Yes, quite right. It was said because you are identifying yourself with the froth and not the water. Because of this confusion the answer was meant to draw your attention to this confusion and bring it home to you. All that is meant is that the Self is infinite inclusive of all that you see. There is nothing beyond It nor apart from It. Knowing this, you will not desire anything; not desiring, you will be content. The Self is always realised. There is no seeking to realise what is already - always - realised. For you cannot deny your own existence. That existence is consciousness - the Self. Unless you exist you cannot ask questions. So you must admit your own existence. That existence is the Self. It is already  realised. Therefore the effort to realise results only in your realising your present mistake - that you have not realised your Self. There is no fresh realisation. The Self becomes revealed.


Devotee:  That will take some years.


Ramana Maharishi:  Why years? The idea of time is only in your mind. It is not in the Self. There is no time for the Self. Time arises as an idea after the ego arises. But you are the Self beyond time and space; you exist even in the absence of time and space.

You are the water and the objects are the bubbles. They cannot exist apart from the water, but they are not quite the same as the water.

Devotee:  Inquiring who the ‘I’ is, I cannot hold it for any length of time. Secondly, I have no interest in the environment, but yet I have hopes that I shall find some interest in life.

Ramana Maharishi:  If there are no interests it is good.

(The interpreter points out that the questioner hopes to find some interest in life).

Ramana Maharishi:  That means there are those vasanas. A dreamer dreams a dream. He sees the dream world with pleasures, pains. etc. But he wakes up and then loses all interest in the dream world. So it is with the waking world also. Just as the dream-world, being only a part of yourself and not different from you, ceases to interest you, so also the present world would cease to interest you if you awake from this waking dream (samsara) and realise that it is a part of your Self, and not an objective reality. Because you think that you are apart from the objects around you, you desire a thing. But if you understand that the thing was only a thought-form you would no longer desire it. All things are like bubbles on water. You are the water and the objects are the bubbles. They cannot exist apart from the water, but they are not quite the same as the water.

After describing the Self as hearer, thinker, vijnata, etc., it is again described as non-hearer, non-thinker, non-knower, Is it so?

Devotee:  After describing the Self as srota (hearer), manta (thinker), vijnata (knower), etc., it is again described as asrota, amanta, avijnata, non-hearer, non-thinker, non-knower, Is it so?


Ramana Maharishi:  Just so. The common man is aware of himself only when modifications arise in the intellect (vijnanamaya kosa); these modifications are transient; they arise and set. Hence the vijnanamaya (intellect) is called a kosa or sheath. When pure awareness is left over it is itself the Chit (Self) or the Supreme. To be in one’s natural state on the subsidence of thoughts is bliss; if that bliss be transient - arising and setting - then it is only the sheath of bliss (Anandamaya kosa), not the pure Self. What is needed is to fix the attention on the pure ‘I’ after the subsidence of all thoughts and not to lose hold of it. This has to be described as an extremely subtle thought; else it cannot be spoken of at all, since it is no other than the Real Self. Who is to speak of it, to whom and how? This is well explained in the Kaivalyam and the Viveka Chudamani. Thus though in sleep the awareness of the Self is not lost, the ignorance of the jiva is not affected by it. For this ignorance to be destroyed this subtle state of mind (vrittijnanam) is necessary; in the sunshine cotton does not burn; but if the cotton be placed under a lens it catches fire and is consumed by the rays of the Sun passing through the lens. So too, though the awareness of the Self is present at  all times, it is not inimical to ignorance. If by meditation the subtle state of thought is won, then ignorance is destroyed. Also in Viveka Chudamani: ativa sukshmam paramatma tattvam na sthoola drishtya (the exceedingly subtle Supreme Self cannot be seen by the gross eye) and esha svayam jyotirasesha sakshi (this is Self-shining and witnesses all). This subtle mental state is not a modification of mind called vritti. Because the mental states are of two kinds. One is the natural state and the other is a transformation into forms of objects. The first is the truth, and the other is according to the doer (kartru-tantra). When the latter perishes, jale kataka renuvat (like the clearing nut paste in water) the former will remain over. The means for this end is meditation. Though this is with the triad of distinction (triputi) it will finally end in pure awareness (jnanam) Meditation needs effort: jnanam is effortless. Meditation can be done, or not done, or wrongly done, jnanam is not so. Meditation is described as kartru-tantra (as doer’s own), jnanam as vastu-tantra (the Supreme’s own).

If the search has to be made within, is it necessary to be in the physical proximity of the Master?

Devotee:  If the search has to be made within, is it necessary to be in the physical proximity of the Master?


Ramana Maharishi:  It is necessary to do so until all doubts are at an end.


Devotee:  If the ego is unreal and troublesome why did we take so much pains to develop it?


Ramana Maharishi:  Its growth and the trouble consequent on such growth make you look for the cause of it all. Its development is for its own destruction.

How are they (Uncertainties, doubts and fears) to disappear?

Devotee:  How are they (Uncertainties, doubts and fears) to disappear?

Ramana Maharishi:  They are the ego. If the ego goes they go with it. The ego is itself unreal. What is the ego? Enquire. The body is insentient and cannot say ‘I’ . The Self is pure consciousness and non-dual. It cannot say ‘I’ . No one says, ‘I’ in sleep. What is the ego then? It is something intermediate between the inert body and the Self. It has no locus standi. If sought for it vanishes like a ghost. You see, a man imagines that there is something by his side in darkness; it may be some dark object. If he looks closely the ghost is not to be seen, but some dark object which he could identify as a tree or a post, etc. If he does not look closely the ghost strikes terror in the person. All that is required is only to look closely and the ghost vanishes. The ghost was never there. So also with the ego. It is an intangible link between the body and Pure Consciousness. It is not real. So long as one does not look closely it continues to give trouble. But when one looks for it, it is found not to exist. Again, in a Hindu marriage function, the feasts continue five or six days. A stranger was mistaken for the best man by the bride’s party and they therefore treated him with special regard. Seeing him treated with special regard by the bride’s party, the bridegroom’s party considered him to be some man of importance related to the bride’s party and therefore they too showed him special respect. The stranger had altogether a happy time of it. He was also all along aware of the real situation. On one occasion the groom’s party wanted to refer to him on some point. They asked for him. He scented trouble and made himself scarce. So it is with the ego. If looked for, it disappears. If not, it continues to give trouble. How it is to be looked for is learnt from those who have already done so. That is the reason why the Master is approached.

Where is the lunatic asylum if it is not within. You will not be in it, but it will be in you

Devotee:  When we read about it we read it intellectually. But it is all too remote. When we see you in body we are brought nearer to Reality and it gives us courage to bring our knowledge into our everyday life. If one realised the Self and acted up to it in the West, one would be locked up in a lunatic asylum. (Laughter.)


Ramana Maharishi:  You will be locking yourself in. Because the world is mad, considers you mad. Where is the lunatic asylum if it is not within. You will not be in it, but it will be in you.  (Laughter).  Uncertainties, doubts and fears are natural to everyone until the Self is realised. They are inseparable from the ego, rather they are the ego.

No special effort is necessary to realise the Self. All efforts are for eliminating the resent obscuration of the Truth.

Ramana Maharishi:   Realisation is of the Self. You cannot remain without  the Self. The Self is always realised. But only you do not recognise the fact. The Realisation is now obscured by the present world idea. The world is now seen outside you and the idea associated with it obscures your real nature. All that is needed is to overcome this ignorance and then the Self stands revealed. No special effort is necessary to realise the Self. All efforts are for eliminating the resent obscuration of the Truth.
A lady is wearing a necklace round her neck. She forgets it, imagines it to be lost and impulsively looks for it here, there and everywhere. Not finding it, she asks her friends if they have found it anywhere, until one kind friend points to her neck and tells her to feel the necklace round the neck. The seeker does so and feels happy that the necklace is found. Again, when she meets her other friends, they ask her if her lost necklace was found. She says ‘yes’ to them, as if it were lost and later recovered. Her happiness on re-discovering it round her neck is the same as if some lost property was recovered. In fact she never lost it nor recovered it. And yet she was once miserable and now she

is happy. So also with the realisation of the Self. The Self is always realised. The Realisation is now obscured. When the veil is removed the person feels happy at rediscovering the ever-realised Self. The ever-present Realisation appears to be a new Realisation. Now, what should one do to overcome the present ignorance. Be eager to have the true knowledge. As this eagerness grows the wrong knowledge diminishes in strength until it finally disappears

How do all thoughts cease when the mind is in the Heart?

Devotee:  How do all thoughts cease when the mind is in the Heart?


Ramana Maharishi:  By force of will, with strong faith in the truth of the Master’s teaching to that effect.


Devotee:  What is the good of this process?


Ramana Maharishi: 
(a) Conquest of the will - development of concentration.
(b) Conquest of passions - development of dispassion.
(c) Increased practice of virtue - (samatva) equality to all.

If the mind is distracted, ask the question promptly, “To whom do these distracting thoughts arise?”

Devotee:  Can the mind be fixed to that point (Heart)? How?

Ramana Maharishi:  If the mind is distracted, ask the question promptly, “To whom do these distracting thoughts arise?” That takes you back to the ‘I’ point promptly


Devotee:  How long can the mind stay or be kept in the Heart?


Ramana Maharishi:  The period extends by practice.


Devotee:  What happens at the end of the period?


Ramana Maharishi:  The mind returns to the present normal state. Unity in the Heart is replaced by variety of phenomena perceived. This is called the outgoing mind. The heart-going mind is called the resting mind.


Devotee:  Is all this process merely intellectual or does it exhibit feeling predominantly?


Ramana Maharishi:  The latter.

How are they (dispassion towards non-self) practised?

Devotee:  How are they (dispassion towards non-self) practised?

Ramana Maharishi:  An examination of the ephemeral nature of external phenomena leads to vairagya.  Hence enquiry (vichara) is the first and foremost step to be taken. When vichara continues automatically, it results in a contempt for wealth, fame, ease, pleasure, etc. The ‘I’ thought becomes clearer for inspection. The source of ‘I’ is the Heart - the final goal.  If, however, the aspirant is not temperamentally suited to Vichara Marga (to the introspective analytical method), he must develop bhakti (devotion) to an ideal - may be God, Guru, humanity in general, ethical laws, or even the idea of beauty.  When one of these takes possession of the individual, other attachments grow weaker, i.e., dispassion (vairagya) develops. Attachment for the ideal simultaneously grows and finally holds the field. Thus ekagrata (concentration) grows simultaneously and imperceptibly - with or without visions and direct aids. In the absence of enquiry and devotion, the natural sedative pranayama (breath regulation) may be tried. This is known as Yoga Marga. If life is  imperilled the whole interest centres round the one point, the saving of life. If the breath is held the mind cannot afford to (and does not) jump at its pets - external objects.  Thus there is rest for the mind so long as the breath is held. All attention being turned on breath or its regulation, other interests are lost. Again, passions are attended with irregular breathing, whereas calm and happiness are attended with slow and regular breathing. Paroxysm of joy is in fact as painful as one of pain, and both are accompanied by ruffled breaths. Real peace is happiness. Pleasures do not form happiness. The mind improves by practice and becomes finer just as the razor’s edge is sharpened by stropping. The mind is then better able to tackle internal or external problems. If an aspirant be unsuited temperamentally for the first two methods and circumstantially (on account of age) for the third method, he must try the Karma Marga (doing good deeds, for example, social service). His nobler instincts become more evident and he derives impersonal pleasure. His smaller self is less assertive and has a chance of expanding its good side. The man becomes duly equipped for one of the three aforesaid paths. His intuition may also develop directly by this single method.

How is restlessness removed from the mind?

Devotee:  How is restlessness removed from the mind?

Ramana Maharishi:  External contacts - contacts with objects other than itself - make the mind restless. Loss of interest in non-Self, (vairagya) is the first step. Then the habits of introspection and concentration follow. They are characterised by control of external senses, internal faculties, etc. (sama, dama, etc.) ending in samadhi (undistracted mind).

How is the mind to be eliminated or relative consciousness transcended?

Devotee:  How is the mind to be eliminated or relative consciousness transcended?


Ramana Maharishi:  The mind is by nature restless. Begin liberating it from its restlessness; give it peace; make it free from distractions; train it to look inward; make this a habit. This is done by ignoring the external world and removing the obstacles to peace of mind.

How shall we discover the nature of the mind i.e., its ultimate cause, or the noumenon of which it is a manifestation?

Devotee:  How shall we discover the nature of the mind i.e., its ultimate cause, or the noumenon of which it is a manifestation?

Ramana Maharishi:  Arranging thoughts in the order of value, the ‘I’ thought is the all important thought.  The second and the third persons do not appear except to the first person.  Trace, then, the ultimate cause of ‘I’ or personality. The ‘I’ idea arises to an embodied ego and should be related to a body or organism. Has it a location in the body or a special relation to any particular spot  Thought-life is seen to centre round the brain and the spinal-cord which in turn are fed by the blood circulating in them, carrying food and air duly mixed up which are transformed into nerve matter. Thus the mind may be regarded as the manifestation of vital force which again may be conceived as residing the Heart.

What is the relation between mind and object? Is the mind contacting something different from it, viz., the world?

Devotee:  What is the relation between mind and object? Is the mind contacting something different from it, viz., the world?

Ramana Maharishi:  The world is ‘sensed’ in the waking and the dream states or is the object of perception and thought, both being mental activities. If there were no such activities as waking and dreaming thought, there would be no ‘perception’ or inference of a ‘world’. In sleep there is no such activity and ‘objects and world’ do not exist for us in sleep. Hence ‘reality of the world’ may be created by the ego by its act of emergence from sleep; and that reality may be swallowed up or disappear by the soul resuming its nature in sleep. The emergence and disappearance of the world are like the spider producing a gossamer web and then withdrawing it.  The spider here underlies all the three states - waking, dreaming, and sleep; such a spider in the person is called Atman (Self), whereas the same with reference to the world (which is considered to issue from the sun) is called Brahman (Supreme Spirit). He that is in man is the same as He that is in the sun. (Sa yaschayam purushe yaschasavaditye sa ekah). While Self or Spirit is unmanifest and inactive, there are no relative doubles; e.g., subject and object - drik and drisya. If the enquiry into the ultimate cause of manifestation of mind itself is pushed on, mind will be found to be only the manifestation of the Real which is otherwise called Atman or Brahman. The mind is termed sukshma sarira or ‘subtle-body’; and jiva is the individual soul. The jiva is the essence of the growth of individuality; personality is referred to as jiva. Thought or mind is said to be its phase, or one of the ways in which the jiva manifests itself - the earlier stage or phase of such manifestation being vegetative life. This mind is always seen as being related to, or acting on, some non-mind or matter, and never by itself. Therefore mind and matter co-exist.

When and how is the disappearance of the objective world (drisya vilaya) to be effected?

Devotee:  When and how is the disappearance of the objective world (drisya vilaya) to be effected?


Ramana Maharishi:  It is complete when the relative subject, namely the mind, is eliminated. The mind is the creator of the subject and the object and is the cause of the dualistic idea. Therefore, it is the cause of the wrong notion of limited self and the misery consequent on such erroneous idea.


Devotee:  What is this mind?


Ramana Maharishi:  Mind is one form of manifestation of life. A block of wood or a subtle machine is not called mind. The vital force manifests as life activity and also as the conscious phenomena known as the mind.

Elimination of drisya (objects) means elimination of separate identities of the subject and object.

Devotee:  Why should the objects - drisya be eliminated? Cannot the Truth be realised even keeping the object as it is?

Ramana Maharishi:  No. Elimination of drisya means elimination of separate identities of the subject and object. The object is unreal. All drisya (including ego) is the object. Eliminating the unreal, the Reality survives. When a rope is mistaken for a snake, it is enough to remove the erroneous perception of the snake for the truth to be revealed. Without such elimination the truth will not dawn.

How is that Self to be known or realised?

Devotee:  How is that Self to be known or realised?

Ramana Maharishi:  Transcend the present plane of relativity. A separate being (Self) appears to know something apart from itself (non-Self). That is, the subject is aware of the object. The seer is drik; the seen is drisya. There must be a unity underlying these two, which arises as ‘ego’. This ego is of the nature of chit (intelligence); achit (insentient object) is only negation of chit. Therefore the underlying essence  is akin to the subject and not the object. Seeking the drik, until all drisya disappears, the drik will become subtler and subtler until the absolute drik alone survives. This process is called drisya vilaya (the disappearance of the objective world).